Should Pete Rose Be in the Baseball Hall of Fame?
64Pete Rose Should Be In Cooperstown
I suspect that baseball fans will never know the complete story behind Major League Baseball's decision to ban Pete Rose for life. We've been told that he was caught gambling on his own team and that created a conflict of interest for him because as manager he had the opportunity to affect the outcome of the game. That makes perfect sense, until you consider the fact that he was never accused of betting against the Reds. It would be easy for a manager to affect the outcome of a game by making decisions that made failure more likely. But as a manager, his main job was to put out the most competitive team possible. Obviously if he was betting on his team winning he would want to do everything possible to field the most competitive team possible. Doesn't sound like a conflict of interest to me!
Pete Rose broke the law by gambling and failing to report his winnings on his taxes (something that I am sure most people who gamble could be convincted of). I was in graduate school at Southern Illinois University at Carbondale when Pete was serving his sentence at the federal penitentiary in Marion, Illinois, just down the road from Carbondale. To me, he has already served his sentence, he's even admitted that he did something wrong, and it's time to move on.
My suspicion is that after Pete Rose dies, somewhere down the road, some future commissioner of baseball will do what each commissioner since this scandal broke could have done, and if that happens, I can bet that Pete Rose will be elected on the first ballot. He brought a lot to the game of baseball and he deserves to be rewarded for it. He certainly belongs there more than, say, Roger Clemens or Barry Bonds, because both of those men, I believe, gave themselves unfair advantages that resulted in skewed statistics. Pete Rose became the career hits leader by working hard. After all, they don't call him Charlie Hustle for nothing!
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I used to have this real rebellious idea of starting my own mini-museum called the Banned Baseball Players Hall of Fame, featuring the likes of Pete Rose, Shoeless Joe Jackson, the rest of the 1919 White Sox and the like.
I should note that although I have a healthy degree of respect for Pete Rose, I am first and foremost a Red Sox fan, so my comments on Rose are not clouded by blind devotion to the Reds.
Agreed Situations do change over time, at least our perceptions do. Great hub
Excellent topic Crash! Who's a bigger liar, Rose for saying he didn't bet on baseball or the current commissioner Bud Selig who claims he was unaware of steroids in baseball? Rose as a player was good for the game, Selig as a commissioner is bad for the game... unless you like tie scores in the All Star game... just one mans opinion...
Very nice Hub!!
Well I can't take credit for the idea - it was a request posted by another hubber. But thanks for your thoughts on what I've written. I'm glad it resonated with you.
Jim
pete rose is as much a hall-of-famer as anyone in the hall. he holds a record that he will continue to hold unless he is reincarnated, which of course won't happen for several generations. 4,256 hits is ridiculous. the only person in recent memory that would've had a glimpse of a chance is ichiro suzuki, who came to the states about 8 years too late to have a shot.
there are very few career records that have no shot of being broken: 511 wins by cy young, 5,700+ k's by nolan ryan and 5,256 hits by pete rose.
I feel he should be in the hall of fame. He earned it, which is hard for me to admit since im a Cub fan. But it's true. Great hub!
I know what you mean Allshookup. As I said above, I'm not a Reds fan, so I have no special allegiance to him. I just look at the situation and say that the guy was one of the top athletes of our time, and those people belong in the hall.
Guess I'll be preaching to the choir here, but it is impossible for me give credence to the hall of fame if they exclude Rose and others who rightly deserve to be there due to their ability to play the game, not their personal failings. If faults were a reason for exclusion in everything in life,no one would ever be recognized for greatness in a sport, business or any other occupation in life.
Vote Rose in! Go Mr. Hustle!
By the way- they filmed a good part of Field of Dreams in my old hometown of Galena, IL., and the baseball field is just about half-an-hour's drive west of there on US 20. Shoeless Joe became something of a hero in our town after that movie was made.
rose would get my vote.nobody's perfect,he deserve's to be in the hall of fame.
In a word? NO.
No, he lied about for about 15 years. He broke the most sacred rule of the game. Every minor and major league clubhouse has the rule against betting on the game posted. And besides this has nothing to do with any type of possible reinstatement to baseball. The Hallis an entity that is completely separate and has their own rules. He is a liar and a cheat, Hell no.Gary
Gary - I can certainly understand your point of view. There is no doubt that he broke the rules, and lied about it, neither of which have anything to do with the accomplishments he made on the field during his career. I can see two circumstances where Pete Rose will get into the Hall of Fame. The first, and probably most likely, is when he dies. His is a lifetime ban, but once his life is done, they can induct him. The other is if Barry "Steroids" Bonds, Roger Clemens, or even Alex Rodriguez eventually get in. They are rule breakers as well, and in Clemens' case in particular, he's been lying about it from day one. If these guys get in, the whole justification for keeping Rose out flies right out the window.
Jim
Why not let him in the hall of fame. Look at all the other sports players& what they have done.Killing dogs,go to Federal Prision Mike Vick. Afootball player drunk & ran over a person, 30 days in jail. You have to be kidding me. Do you think Pete Rose done steriods,not. It is so unjust not to let him in the hall of fame. Look at all the other sports players do & what they have gotten buy with. Pete Rose is one of the best players ever to play the game & should be in the hall of fame. Tim
Tim:
While I agree with the premise that Pete Rose belongs in the hall, I would say that your arguments will become more persuasive only if they begin electing steroid junkies like Roger Clemens, Alex Rodriguez, Mark McGuire and the boys to the Hall of Fame.
Thanks for your comment!
Jim
There are surely no stains at all on the ones who decide who enters the hall of fame. We are human beings. Pete Rose was one of the most skilled and hard working ball players ever. Of course he should be in the hall of fame.
Good hub! :)
Tom - Thanks for the note. I wonder if there is sufficient support for Pete in Cincinatti and Philadelphia to mount a public campaign for him to be inducted. Baseball is, first and foremost, a business, and I think it would be great for business if they decided to lift the ban. Anyone have any thoughts on this matter?
Jim, aka CrashCromwell
I had been big fan of pete rose for almost 25 years and meet him 2 times and write a ball to me but I think he must should be in the baseball hall of fame !!! beause he been work hard for cincinnati reds and helped on world champion on 1975 and 1976 also hit lot many years. So please go to vote with him and he will be gone before vote him !! Iam deaf man and 61 years old . thanks !!
Thanks for your feedback Stephen!
Jim Henry
Hey, I'd appreciate if you'd fill out a survey I'm conducting for my thesis, Crisis Communication and MLB Public Relations. Pete Rose is among the selected case studies.
Age:
MLB and Crisis, Fan Survey
The purpose of this survey is to gain insight into the fan’s perception of MLB and its players in the context of crisis. Fan’s responses will help evaluate MLB’s public relation efforts to shape the intended perception of the game.
(1-10, 1 being the lowest/ strongly disagree, 10 being the highest/ strongly agree, N/A for unknown)
1. Roger Clemens should be in the hall of fame. ___________
2. Clemens should not serve time for the indictments he faces. ___________
3. Clemens should serve the maximum sentence for committing perjury before the grand jury. ___________
4. I am no longer a fan of Clemens due to his display of a lack of integrity. ____________
5. I would be a much bigger fan of Clemens had he owned up to cheating. ___________
6. Steroids in baseball have shattered the integrity of sacred records. __________
7. MLB has taken the necessary steps to cleanse the organization of steroids. __________
8. The Mitchell Report displays a desire to reform. __________
9. Barry Bonds is first ballot Hall of Fame. __________
10. Armando Galaragga should be sportsman of the year. __________
11. Jim Joyce is man of integrity, and represents baseball well. ________
12. I forgive Jim Joyce for stealing perfection from Galaragga. __________
13. Andy Pettitte is a sell out for contributing to the case against Clemens and using. _________
14. Baseball is our Nation’s pastime. _________
15. Steroids are responsible for bringing baseball back. ___________
16. It is easier to forgive professional athletes than politicians or other leaders. ____________
17. I feel a uniquely strong attachment to professional athletes. __________
18. Players that used steroids did it in the interest of the game. ___________
19. Players that used steroids were justified to maintain a level playing field _____________
20. Pete Rose should be in the Hall of Fame. _________
21. Baseball will never be the game it was before the strike. ___________
22. Cal Ripken JR. brought baseball back. ________
23. Baseball is no different than any other sport. _________
24. Jason Giambi is a role model for admitting his use. ___________
25. I am aware that Giambi is the only active MLB player appearing in the Mitchell Report to admit use. __________
26. Large contracts played a significant role in steroid use. _________
27. Jose Canseco is a man of integrity for throwing up red flags on steroid use in MLB. ________
28. I do not respect players that used. _____________
29. All players named in The Mitchell Report should be penalized under law. ___________
30. I was disappointed when Bonds shattered the single season home run record. _________
31. Baseball is close to my heart. _____________
32. Athletes have a greater influence over children than any other icons. ____________
33. MLB is responsible for players using steroids. _________
34. Use of steroids does not change the way I feel about baseball. ___________
Age: 43
MLB and Crisis, Fan Survey
The purpose of this survey is to gain insight into the fan’s perception of MLB and its players in the context of crisis. Fan’s responses will help evaluate MLB’s public relation efforts to shape the intended perception of the game.
(1-10, 1 being the lowest/ strongly disagree, 10 being the highest/ strongly agree, N/A for unknown)
1. Roger Clemens should be in the hall of fame. 1
2. Clemens should not serve time for the indictments he faces 1
3. Clemens should serve the maximum sentence for committing perjury before the grand jury. 10
4. I am no longer a fan of Clemens due to his display of a lack of integrity. 7
5. I would be a much bigger fan of Clemens had he owned up to cheating. 10
6. Steroids in baseball have shattered the integrity of sacred records. 5
7. MLB has taken the necessary steps to cleanse the organization of steroids. 1
8. The Mitchell Report displays a desire to reform. 7
9. Barry Bonds is first ballot Hall of Fame. 1
10. Armando Galaragga should be sportsman of the year. 9
11. Jim Joyce is man of integrity, and represents baseball well. N/A
12. I forgive Jim Joyce for stealing perfection from Galaragga. N/A
13. Andy Pettitte is a sell out for contributing to the case against Clemens and using. 10
14. Baseball is our Nation’s pastime. 5
15. Steroids are responsible for bringing baseball back. 1
16. It is easier to forgive professional athletes than politicians or other leaders. 1
17. I feel a uniquely strong attachment to professional athletes. 5
18. Players that used steroids did it in the interest of the game. 1
19. Players that used steroids were justified to maintain a level playing field 1
20. Pete Rose should be in the Hall of Fame. 10
21. Baseball will never be the game it was before the strike. 1
22. Cal Ripken JR. brought baseball back. 5
23. Baseball is no different than any other sport. 1
24. Jason Giambi is a role model for admitting his use. 2
25. I am aware that Giambi is the only active MLB player appearing in the Mitchell Report to admit use. 10
26. Large contracts played a significant role in steroid use. 10
27. Jose Canseco is a man of integrity for throwing up red flags on steroid use in MLB. 1
28. I do not respect players that used. 10
29. All players named in The Mitchell Report should be penalized under law. 10
30. I was disappointed when Bonds shattered the single season home run record. 10
31. Baseball is close to my heart. 10
32. Athletes have a greater influence over children than any other icons. 10
33. MLB is responsible for players using steroids. 5
34. Use of steroids does not change the way I feel about baseball. 1
The problem with Rose being put in the Hall of Fame is not so much his past sins as it is the hypocrites who vote for induction. The very same people who say they would NEVER vote for that steroid-using Mark McGwire turn around and say they WOULD vote for that steroid-using Roger Clemens. You have people who send in blank ballots because they think no one is worthy of a 100% induction vote (I've not yet been to Cooperstown but I haven't seen any photos of plaques that have "elected by X%" etched on the plaques). On top of this we currently have a baseball commissioner who has a spine of spaghetti. If George Steinbrenner could be reinstated after TWO bans from baseball why not Pete?
BTW, for the record, I'm a huge Reds fan, and I think Pete Rose is three of the four biggest jerks on the planet. But no one in his/her right mind can deny what the man did between the lines.
KF Raizor - You may be correct about purists and whether they will hold their nose and vote for Pete or not. Personally, I see a big difference between what Pete Rose did and what the steroid users did, because they make their case for induction in the hall of fame based upon skewed numbers. Again, I feel that what Rose did may have been wrong, but did nothing to change the outcome of games.
Pete Rose may be a big jerk. So was Ty Cobb, but no one has ever suggested that he does not belong in the hall because of his personality short comings.
Oh and I have had the good fortune to go to Cooperstown with my dad a number of years ago, and at least at that point they did not include the percentage of votes they received. I doubt that has changed. Thanks for the note!
Jim
Pete Rose should absolutely be in the Hall of Fame. Yeah, what he did was wrong, but Hall of Fame "standards" only seem to apply on a pick and choose basis. Rose was a much better player than many others in the HOF and there are others in the HOF who have done wrong as well. Good hub!
When Bill Clinton was in the white house, my dad hated him, because of his womanizing. I kept saying to him that we elected a politician, not a pope. I think the same holds true with Pete Rose. Did he do something wrong? Sure! And he paid the price. However, the fact that he allegedly bet FOR his team to win should make this a no-brainer. If he had been betting for his team to lose, I would not feel the way I do, because it is much easier to throw a game than to ensure a victory.
Jim
William F. Torpey Level 2 Commenter 3 years ago
Nice job, crashcromwell. Cooperstown should include all the best ballplayers. It's a "baseball" Hall of Fame, not a cathedral for saints. Pete's record and behavior on the diamond were exemplary. I agree that someday a wise commissioner will see to it that justice prevails. It took a "Veterans Committee" vote to get Phil Rizzuto into Cooperstown. Sometimes justsice comes late, but better late than never!